Weckl's Evolution Series DVD's Review and Question

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Originally posted by Randy Walker:
How true that statement is...........Most guys or gals whom call themselves drummers don't bother to work on the big task at hand and that is understanding how a drum SHOULD sound.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I understand what you mean randy though if it sounds good to someone [the player himself, HIS sound] is it wrong that he's tuned it that way?

Sound is such a subjective matter and what someone thinks is Bad, is good to someone else.
The theory of "a drum should be in tune with itself" is ok. I just see people that dont care about drum tuning theory as, people breaking the theory rules like musicians who break the rules of music theory, its not wrong, just their way. And as the old saying goes, "there is no right or wrong way" just your way.

hi,
To find these DVD, there is hudson europe :
weckl DVD
bye

They ok for europeans Bouts as they are in Pal format.
Unless the people in the states have a pal dvd and tv with pal to ntsc conversion, they wont be any good. Not sure about a computer though? And the price is WAY up from a usa price too. [img]frown.gif[/img]

I hear what you are sayig, for me I am in to the wide open drum singing type of tuning, the Mike Portnoy dead no tone does nothing for me. Guys like Vinnie, Simon, Smith, Erskine, recently Gadd, Jordan all get this type of sound. In the early days Gadd was into the dead sound but has since changed his sound. Larrie London used to get such a huge sound sound.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Randy Walker:
How true that statement is...........Most guys or gals whom call themselves drummers don't bother to work on the big task at hand and that is understanding how a drum SHOULD sound.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Totally agree...and I'm one of them. Only recently have I got into all of this. I really believe who you hang with has a big influence on your drum habits. When I was younger it was all drums, details, finish, tuning, etc. Then it became technique and I gave up on sound. Amazing how great a guy can be technically and totally forget how his kit sounds to the audience--all non-drummers.

Plenty of "resonance" is what I understand you too mean.

I just think some people aren't that bothered randy, tuning is an 'art' and some cats are just happy with what they have or havent got/learned. In some ways i suppose its like looking at a guy who's pushing his technique while another settles for what he has.
Thats my interpretation, im not saying its a fact, its sort of like, "Oh, that'll do for me, thats good enough".

Can we class people with a Drum dial as inbetweenies... lol
(I hope im not going to be flamed for that) [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]eek.gif[/img]

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Originally posted by Me.2:

Can we class people with a Drum dial as inbetweenies... lol

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">LOL! That?s funny. Actually I find in Sydney most drummers seem to be really into how their drums sound. Not very often you hear a kit sound that detracts from the music.

doesn't Russ Miller also have a book(video)on "The Art of Tuning"?

Like Me2 said, tuning is left for personal preference and taste. What u have to realize Randy is everyone has their "pet sounds". Most metal drummers would favor that "dead/hydraulic" type of sound most metal drummers(Danny Carey/Portnoy)go for, alot of old school LOVE that cardboard sound(Eagles/Billy Joel for example), sum may like their snare to be very crip and have a killer attack(Copeland), sum may like Carter Beauford's snare(listen to "Razpunzel" for example)

I learned to tune drums from watching other drummers and just experimenting with head combinations and tuning methods(rather than just muffling the crap out of my drums [img]cool.gif[/img] )

I hear what u r sayin, me, but this time, i can't go w that much of that liberal esoteric type thinking -
My 1st acoustic kit was a Fibes w hydraulic heads & no bottom heads on the toms...my 2nd & present kit is a Gretsch w bottom heads & it sounds INFINITELY better than my 1st kit...
In other words, muted, "cardboard" drums sound like sh** compared to well-tuned, wide-open drums...
I guess one could go for different fx or sounds like is done in some tunes nowadays, but...
I realize that this is what some like to refer to as "my opinion," but it [& Randy's} happens to be the right one here [img]wink.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img] [certain opins CAN be right & wrong, can they not?! i know, i know, there's arguments for either side on that one] [img]biggrin.gif[/img]
...but i guess that is just MY opin, right? [I'll prob be hearing YOURS soon, but it is also just an opinion, right? ;o) ]
[img]tongue.gif[/img]

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Originally posted by FuseU1:
I hear what u r sayin, me, but this time, i can't go w that much of that liberal esoteric type thinking -

well..there ya go! a bit of that Liberal thinking fuse might do you the world of good. :-)

My 1st acoustic kit was a Fibes w hydraulic heads & no bottom heads on the toms...my 2nd & present kit is a Gretsch w bottom heads & it sounds INFINITELY better than my 1st kit...
In other words, muted, "cardboard" drums sound like sh** compared to well-tuned, wide-open drums...

hmmm...Now be fair, i did not state that i dislike OPEN drums. Actually i made no comment to open/boxy or whatever sound people made.

Me.2! ( no me) I had a Fibes fiberglass kit.

At the time fuse i bet you loved your fibes single headed drums, I playing'em was more a priority than the sound eminating from'em.

Now, that single headed sound was once an IN thing like double headed are now the IN thing again.

Seeing sound is subjective, sounds appear to come'n'go and then revive again, Even Solid snares went out for plied shells, while now most it seems want a craviotto solid. fads/trends?

Looking back how many times did peart win the best recorded sound in modern drummer with single headed drums? A sound that thousands wanted to have themselves as i remember.
Even Neil went from double to single to double again! Times change as do sounds, here today gone tomorrow.

Now its YOUR opinion fuse that single headed drums sound sh%t but reggae i believe has been built on that sound(im probably wrong -my bad), its a part of it, Just as jazz generally has that constant ringing ride cymbal pattern and Bozzio is defining his music with HIS sounds. Whats Good and bad....NONE of it. Its all music.

I guess one could go for different fx or sounds like is done in some tunes nowadays, but...
I realize that this is what some like to refer to as "my opinion," but it [& Randy's} happens to be the right one here [certain opins CAN be right & wrong, can they not?! i know, i know, there's arguments for either side on that one] [img]biggrin.gif[/img]
...but i guess that is just MY opin, right? [I'll prob be hearing YOURS soon, but it is also just an opinion, right? ]

An opinion is an opinion fuse, that doesnt make it a FACT, opinions are subjective i think?

Who defines what is 'right and wrong', as in, how a drum SHOULD be tuned/or sound.....where is the LAW on this?

To be truthful fuse i'm not sure what your post is about, though, as you mention Randy i can only assume that you are referring to his post....'Most guys n girls who call themselves drummers dont bother to work on the big task at hand and that is understanding how a drum SHOULD sound'.

If it is...I'll bite, and you want my opinion right? How could i not oblige when steve freely and kindly/generously gives US this site TO give our thoughts/opinions. So, Respect to steve.

I agree with randys thoughts, though i also disagee. Im on the fence i guess.

I think a drummer should have an understanding of tuning, though i dont consider it a neccesity and its certainly NOT, as there are countless people working OUT THERE without what others might term as..... UNTUNED drums.
What to some sounds crap, is good to others, as is different music. To say someones drums sound bad is subjective.

Basically, a drummers sound can define him as much as his phrasing can, whether he's tuned to OTHERS pitch desires or not.
I dont mind open or closed/muted sounds i'm not preferential towards one or the other,Its a sound.


Is a drummer who cant tune (to others desired standards) a lesser drummer?
No, just as buddy and dennis dont/didnt read music its something they dont have as a DRUMMER/musician. Its an ASPECT of them as a musician that they chose not to follow, and nothing wrong in that, unless theres a RIGHT way that people should do things?
i.e considering miles davis played blues notes shouldn't have someone corrected him about that or did it define HIS sound, being out of tune.

What about miles muting his trumpet like dulling a drum head to a single tom sound, whats better? neither, its just a sound.

I like miles wide open and closed/muted in tune or out of tune, its a Part of him and HIS sound.
Now, whats the right/correct one?

You see, though people mention tuning, to me its weird point.
Take a saxophone, it doesnt play in tune and the musician tries to make it/correct the instruments design flaws by placing the mouth piece on the correct point [for him] on the crook. Its still out of tune though.
Same with a guitar, once tuned up its still out of tune. People should learn to tune up to people that are already out of tune? lol

Heres a great one.
When was the last time you saw a Piano player tune his Piano? They dont, Piano Tuners do.

So, Why are they exempt from tuning their instrument, are they lesser musicians for not tuning the piano? In or out of tune they just play the gig.
Do most people notice the instruments pitch flaws or are they not bothered and just enjoy the music? See, sound is so subjective and wide open(no pun) saying its this or that seems pointless, sound.... JUST IS.

There ya go fuse some of my opinion, btw I NEVER say i'm right as, its ONLY my opinion.
If its a FACT , i'll state that.
{no offense meant by my post)

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